90% of people buy boots that are too stiff

[Skidog]

Friend, one of the best skiers on the hill, doesn’t even buckle his lower buckles on one boot cuz they’re broken. For him, his fit is so dialed, he doesn’t mess with them and doesn’t feel the need.

Wait...you guys buckle them? I thought those things were like for looks? Buncha amateurs.

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[Soups]

Friend, one of the best skiers on the hill, doesn’t even buckle his lower buckles on one boot cuz they’re broken. For him, his fit is so dialed, he doesn’t mess with them and doesn’t feel the need.

Complete bullshit until you/him posts a video of him skiing and a certain someone can evaluate!

[wasatchback]

You realize this is bullshit and based on no scientific studies? Boots are colored for branding purposes, so they can sell you the same shell next year for full price with a new colorway. Hirscher was probably wearing stiffer socks one day.

100% not compete bullshit.. and most manufacturers have plenty of data to back it up

[AZskibum]

I'm 150 lbs and an advanced (not expert by any means) skier. I'm still learning to keep my boots flexed (Lange 140 Xt3) and it's a battle in the trees, bumps super steep stuff. But I think it's just a skill thing, because when I adjust I can flex them.. I think.

[onenerdykid]

You realize this is bullshit and based on no scientific studies? Boots are colored for branding purposes, so they can sell you the same shell next year for full price with a new colorway. Hirscher was probably wearing stiffer socks one day.

If you had the same boot, injected in the exact same plastic, but the left one was black and the right one was red/white/yellow/whatever, and you left them sitting in the sun, which boot do you think would get softer, quicker?

That test aside, color affects the feel of the boot, but only to certain degree and 99.99% of the general skiing population don't feel it. There are racers who say they can totally feel the difference between certain colors and their test times show it (even when boots are lacquered and they can't see it).

What also affects the feel of the boot is the percentage of color added to the plastic mixture and I would say this is more tangible than which color is being tested. A normal amount of color (called master badge) is around 2-3%. If I reduce that down to 0.5% or up to 6%, this certainly causes the plastic to behave differently.

There's a reason our race boots don't change color year to year and have remained constant for at about 10 years now. Yes, Atomic's brand color is red, but we don't change the shade of it. The athletes like where it currently is and changing it is a huge ordeal.

[subtle plague]

Pretty sure we all "mostly try to ski powder" and I'm also pretty sure that we all mostly DON'T ski powder. .

Speak for yourself.

Edit: to jump onto the radness of the last posts. I can definitely feel the color of my boots. I wear comfortable colors only.

[skifishbum]

i skis with my boots in walk mode sometimes
and still slays it
but im a 10%er

[glademaster]

Simpleton.

People who use simpleton as an insult belong in the asshole thread in PR.

Need a link? I'll see ya in there.

[subtle plague]

and still slays it
but im a 10%er

The weed thread is one thread further.

Just to give your dick waving a direction.
And after this thread I can picture timber ridge in his chateau conversing with the mundane and telling his world economic forum friends about the needs of the average Joe in the evening.

[big kook]

I regularly clap my 130's.

[FlimFlamvanHam]

^^ fuck yeah brah

I'm 150 lbs and an advanced (not expert by any means) skier. I'm still learning to keep my boots flexed (Lange 140 Xt3) and it's a battle in the trees, bumps super steep stuff. But I think it's just a skill thing, because when I adjust I can flex them.. I think.

And no offence AZ, but you may be in that 90% the OP was talking about. How did your 150lb, advanced but not expert self end up in a 140? Based on your advice, and of course there are other factors, but it reads like your boots are not doing you any favors.

[turnfarmer]

Could be a limited ankle dorsiflexion thing.
A heel lift might be your friend

[senior researcher]

What she said,"more tongue!"

[Like a Boss]

Based off this thread I'm buying these, and anyone that doesn't ski these is a PU$$Y:

https://shop.atomic.com/en/products/...ae0001487.html

But really though, almost all flex indexes are pure bullshit. I had a pair of Lange RS 130 LVs that I pulled both rear-cuff screws out of to soften them when they were brand new, then put one screw back in, then both screws back in as they softened. Meanwhile, my next pair was RX 130 LVs that needed no such treatment. They were both 130s? Nah brah. But really though, get the 170 flex Atomics and you'll be fine.

[SoVT Joey]

Based off this thread I'm buying these, and anyone that doesn't ski these is a PU$$Y:

https://shop.atomic.com/en/products/...ae0001487.html

But really though, almost all flex indexes are pure bullshit. I had a pair of Lange RS 130 LVs that I pulled both rear-cuff screws out of to soften them when they were brand new, then put one screw back in, then both screws back in as they softened. Meanwhile, my next pair was RX 130 LVs that needed no such treatment. They were both 130s? Nah brah. But really though, get the 170 flex Atomics and you'll be fine.

That’s because of the flex engagement range. RS engages faster so it feels stiffer then the rx. Also your liner is very different between those two boots stock and the liner tongue and lace up makes the rs act stiffer as well.

[Marshal Olson]

That’s because of the flex engagement range. RS engages faster so it feels stiffer then the rx. Also your liner is very different between those two boots stock and the liner tongue and lace up makes the rs act stiffer as well.

they are also made of different plastic (RX is a PE lower, the RS is a PU lower).

[onenerdykid]

they are also made of different plastic (RX is a PE lower, the RS is a PU lower).

I really wish Lange would stop abbreviating their plastics this way. It doesn't make things more clear, it just muddies the waters and adds to the amount of confusion in ski boots.

Polyurethane is a general group of plastics that is abbreviated PU.

PUs are available as Polyurethane-ether (also referred to as polyether), which is the super good stuff; or Polyurethane-ester (also referred to polyester), which is pretty good stuff. Both can easily and confusingly be abbreviated as PE. There is further confusion since low-end Polyethylene (shitty plastic) is also abbreviated as PE.

And when Lange refers to an RS shell as PE, I can safely assume it is not polyethylene but I don't know if they mean ether or ester material. And then what does that mean for what they call "PU"?

If a brand is going to distinguish between the different PUs, the best way would be as PU-ether or PU-ester.

Sorry for the rant. Maybe I should just shoot Thor a text haha

[Mudfoot]

Stiff boots give you an On/Off touch when you are weighting the front of your skis. Instant response but almost no feel. A good 3-piece Cabrio shell like a Full Tilt or Dalbello with initially soft and then progressively stiffer flex as you lean into it gives you a much more nuanced feel of the ski and snow but feels sloppy to someone coming off a stiff boot. It is an acquired taste. I liked the way I could hang on the front of my old Flexons and then Kryptons and the flex would act as a shock absorber in funky snow. Some people like point and shoot stiffness to attack the slope while others prefer a soft touch for making love to the mountain. Dealer's choice.

[Dee Hubbs]

Sorry for the rant. Maybe I should just shoot Thor a text haha

Make sure you tell him "Red is always faster"

[gregL]

If a brand is going to distinguish between the different PUs, the best way would be as PU-ether or PU-ester.

Pretty sure Thor and other product managers would agree, it's the marketing and copywriting people who are clueless. First get them to stop calling Titanal "Titanium."

[GoldMember]

I'm 150 lbs and an advanced (not expert by any means) skier. I'm still learning to keep my boots flexed (Lange 140 Xt3) and it's a battle in the trees, bumps super steep stuff. But I think it's just a skill thing, because when I adjust I can flex them.. I think.

^^ fuck yeah brah



And no offence AZ, but you may be in that 90% the OP was talking about. How did your 150lb, advanced but not expert self end up in a 140? Based on your advice, and of course there are other factors, but it reads like your boots are not doing you any favors.

Yup. AZ, your boots are too stiff. You should probably be in a Lange 120 flex, it would suit you better. I wouldn't guess that you'll ever need more than a 130. When trying to load a stiff boot, the boot will resist and put you back more than any advantage you're gaining with a really stiff boot. That's why you're battling those conditions.

[Fred Pabst]

Stiff boots give you an On/Off touch when you are weighting the front of your skis. Instant response but almost no feel. A good 3-piece Cabrio shell like a Full Tilt or Dalbello with initially soft and then progressively stiffer flex as you lean into it gives you a much more nuanced feel of the ski and snow but feels sloppy to someone coming off a stiff boot. It is an acquired taste. I liked the way I could hang on the front of my old Flexons and then Kryptons and the flex would act as a shock absorber in funky snow. Some people like point and shoot stiffness to attack the slope while others prefer a soft touch for making love to the mountain. Dealer's choice.

I was a Krypton guy for awhile. Went through a couple pairs. They were a 130 flex I believe but I never liked the way they skied with the stiff tongue. I would always dumb them down by using the softer flex one. Fast forward a few years. Moved away from Dalbello and back into Lange's. Yeah I got the blue ones! I am day two into my second pair of Lange RS 130W. I absolutely love that boot. I have an easy foot to fit I guess. Never had to do any modes. Put in a different mid-sole, replace with a real booster strap good to go.

Those red Atomic 170's look pretty bad ass. I can't imagine what those must feel like especially on a cold day..I am not worthy!

[onenerdykid]

Pretty sure Thor and other product managers would agree, it's the marketing and copywriting people who are clueless. First get them to stop calling Titanal "Titanium."

This gets me too, I think it's a hang-up coming from the German to English.

[GoldMember]

Pretty sure Thor and other product managers would agree, it's the marketing and copywriting people who are clueless. First get them to stop calling Titanal "Titanium."

This gets me too, I think it's a hang-up coming from the German to English.

No, it's not a language thing, it's a metallurgy thing. Titanal is a high strength aluminum alloy with zinc, magnesium, and copper. It's a product of AMAG Austria Metall AG. It's their marketing people who deceivingly tagged it Titanal thereby confusing it with titanium. There is no titanium in Titanal and any ski marketing group who calls is titanium is wrongly misleading the buyer.

[detrusor]

Tit-anal


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