So how hard is skiing

[XXX-er]

Skiing is very hard from the technique point of view

we all know (or are?) that skier who can drink/smoke/eat to excess/ not train and then get on skis when the snow flies & rip cuz they know how to ski

some sports require you to be in shape or be big or be tall or naturaly fast but are not necessarily that hard to do ,like a lot of endurance sports

and some sports are really just games

[tenB]

Skiing has never been easier. With modern equipment any suburban wanna-be fag can come flying down the Grand Montet in a sitting potion thru deep snow, with his inner monologue telling him 'dude your so f@#king extremo!' When up point out to this London citizen that he has no technique, he responds, ' dude that's my style!'

Bullseye!! It used to be that snowboarding was easy, but skiing takes the crown these days. "Hey, I have fat skis, and skiiers are the best athletes in the world, so I must be a goddamn stud!"

[wcf3]

Comparing how 'hard' one sport is to another is probably bullshit (apples and oranges, etc.) but can be fun bullshit. Kind of like comparing athletes from different eras...

A couple of criteria by which one could make a comparison:

1) How long does it take for someone (with some talent) to reach a high level in a sport starting from scratch?
2) How difficult is it (how long are the odds) that someone (with some talent) would be able to make it to the highest level (olympic medalist, top pro, etc.)?

3) My favorite is a variation on the 'superstars' or ESPN poll type of assesments: Take a top athlete from a sport, how many other sports will he also be fairly strong at with limited preperation.

Using the first criteria, skiing is up there, due to the combined requirements of conditioning and technical skills required, although it probably doesn't take as long to get to a high level as in something with even higher technical difficulty (golf, say).

For the second criteria, one of the main considerations is 'depth/size of talent pool', i.e. how many people compete/participate in the sport seriously. For my taste, the 'most difficult' sport using this criteria is soccer (football for non-gringos). Although there are a lot of skiers, the number of 'serious' skiers is pretty small compared to soccer, basketball, running, etc.

Taking the third criteria, skiing is a strong contender as well, since it requires a pretty well rounded athlete to be successful at a high level, particularly for racers. Compared to other sports, skiers need strong technical skills, ability to deal with high risks, decent strength and good anaerobic endurance. Where they generally will come in somwhat 'light' is in upperbody strength and aerobic endurance. The sports which I think might produce the top contenders based on this criteria are (in no particular order) water polo, wrestling and decathalon.

[mangle]

Like I said, I am not ripping on Lance, just pointing out that since he spends so much time training on his bike, he is working a different muscle set and and different firing pattern while the college runners are putting more time in running. HE WOULD LOSE IF HE WAS RUNNING at a high level college track meet. My dad is huge into road biking and I can outrun him and his road bike friends who are in way better shape than me. I am not even that great at running.

Is this the same Lance Armstrong who runs 2h45min marathons, just for fun?

[old goat]

All sports are equally "hard", obviously. Just as obviously all sports are hard in different ways--they all require different combinations of speed, endurance, agility, balance, good vision, steadiness (shooting, archery) strength, brains, and the ability to endure pain. One of the least appreciated attributes, applicable to just about any sport, is the ability to enjoy practice. Top athletes don't force themselves to practice, they have to force themselves not to practice--they're practice junkies.

I think skiing and hockey share a lot of the same requirements--obviously agility, balance, and short burst endurance. Speed in both does not depend on RPM's--unlike running a sprint for example. Both require obliviousness to danger. The hardest sport I've tried has to be windsurfing though. Friend of mine met Katarina Witt windsurfing in the gorge--she was with a boyfriend who windsufed--she tried it all morning and gave up.

[SkiFaxon]

Skiing is easy until you get good at it.

Having started skiing 3 years ago, I will agree with that statement (snowboarded for >10). It has taken me 3 seasons to get to a point where I fell pretty proficient. While I would not hesitate to dart through trees on a snowboard it took me several seasons to be comfortable enough on skis to do it. Skiing 'properly' is certainly way more technical than I had anticipated.

[toast2266]

That poll is such crap. Bowling is way harder than what they're giving it credit for. It takes a lot of work (years) to get to a decent average (+200).

whereas all of the other sports listed can be mastered in mere hours.

With the glaring exception of baseball, I think that poll does a decent job of analyzing it. Sports like skiing though, where there are lots of different disciplines under the same generalized category, can't really be assessed with such a broad brush.

Skiing's harder than baseball though. Hell, taking a big shit is harder than baseball.

[XXX-er]

curling,lawn bowling (huge in france BTW), indoor bowling ,golf ... are GAME's

[SkiFaxon]

Comparing how 'hard' one sport is to another is probably bullshit (apples and oranges, etc.) but can be fun bullshit. Kind of like comparing athletes from different eras...

A couple of criteria by which one could make a comparison:

1) How long does it take for someone (with some talent) to reach a high level in a sport starting from scratch?
2) How difficult is it (how long are the odds) that someone (with some talent) would be able to make it to the highest level (olympic medalist, top pro, etc.)?

3) My favorite is a variation on the 'superstars' or ESPN poll type of assesments: Take a top athlete from a sport, how many other sports will he also be fairly strong at with limited preperation.

Using the first criteria, skiing is up there, due to the combined requirements of conditioning and technical skills required, although it probably doesn't take as long to get to a high level as in something with even higher technical difficulty (golf, say).

I like your points here. I have contended, with much ridicule, that good golfers (say < 3 handicap) posses high levels of athletic ability. They may not posses the necessary conditioning but usually posses the coordination to be immediately proficient at just about any sport.

[GeezerSteve]

Definition of sport:

an athletic activity requiring skill or physical prowess and often of a competitive nature, as racing, baseball, tennis, golf, bowling, wrestling, boxing, hunting, fishing, etc.

e.g., Golf requires great physical skill , but not necessarily physical prowess, to shoot under par. Long distance running requires great physical prowess , but not necessarily skill, to compete at an elite level. Alpine skiing requires some level of both, of course.

Sports and games are not mutually exclusive. Golf is both a game and a sport. Football, hockey, basketball, soccer, etc., etc. are both games and sports.

It's silly to compare the relative difficulty of a sport that requires largely gross motor skills and strength (e.g. alpine downhill skiing) to a sport that largely requires eye-hand coordination (e.g., golf) to a sport that largely require C-V endurance (long distance running) to a sport that requires a combination of endurance and gross motor skills (e.g., cross-country skiing, ski touring) to a sport that requires a combination of gross motor skills, judgment, technique and endurance (mountaineering). Apples vs. oranges vs. watermelons vs. tomatoes vs. strawberries.

[Tunco]

That poll is such crap. Bowling is way harder than what they're giving it credit for. It takes a lot of work (years) to get to a decent average (+200).

MARK IT ZERO!

[westoxified]

curling,lawn bowling (huge in france BTW), indoor bowling ,golf ... are GAME's

for sure.

so... in summary... if you suck at something it is not a sport and you should get drunk instead.

[garyfromterrace]

And before the internet that Hemingway quote did not include "motor racing", only bullfighting and mountain climbing...

Actually there is some debate as to whether or not Hemmingway even said it. As for your "before the internet...." comment, uh, sorry but you're out to lunch here buddy. If Hemmingway didn't say it it's a mute point, if he did say it you're wrong.

Whatever........,the point is that there are ton's of psuedo sports out there that are GAMES, not sports.

The original question "so how hard is skiing compared to other sports?" I think the objective way to rule on this is to compare the performance of skiing's top athletes vs. those of other sports. This was done, and skiers seemed to kick some ass. So I'd say compared to the other sports skiing is hard. We all know skiing kicks ass period.

[GeezerSteve]

See the definition of sport in my prior post.

Now, read carefully: The terms sport and game are not mutually exclusive. Some sports are games, e.g., football, baseball, soccer, golf. A sport is also a game if the sport is conducted as a competition with rules. When the competitors are measured by elapsed time, the competitive event is called a race. Some sports sometimes take the form of races, e.g., alpine skiing, nordic skiing, running.

Some, but not all, games are sports. Some, but not all, racing events are sports. Some sports are neither games nor races.

And there is no apostrophe in tons, the plural form of ton, which is sometimes used in colloquial fashion to mean "many."

[Millsie]

whereas all of the other sports listed can be mastered in mere hours.

With the glaring exception of baseball, I think that poll does a decent job of analyzing it. Sports like skiing though, where there are lots of different disciplines under the same generalized category, can't really be assessed with such a broad brush.

Skiing's harder than baseball though. Hell, taking a big shit is harder than baseball.

Baseball is Not easy. Hitting a round ball with a round bat is extremely hard to do. Especially if that round ball is traveling over 90 mph. Even the best hitters fail 70% of the time.

[wcf3]

Baseball is Not easy. Hitting a round ball with a round bat is extremely hard to do. Especially if that round ball is traveling over 90 mph. Even the best hitters fail 70% of the time.

Not a fan of baseball, and thought that the place it got in the ESPN poll was totally bogus, but I would have to second this opinion. Just ask Michael Jordan, who qualifies as a good athlete, using any measuring stick.

[GeezerSteve]

MJ was a niche athlete, a one sport pony. The guy spent thousands of dollars on golf lessons but nonetheless has an ugly ass swing and hands of clay. MJ is a manifestly inelegant golfer. Other than basketball and, maybe, high jumping, long jumping or triple jumping, could MJ excel at any other sport?

OTOH, it seems that most NHL players and MLB pitchers retire and are low handicap golfers within a year or two.

[wcf3]

MJ was a niche athlete, a one sport pony. The guy spent thousands of dollars on golf lessons but nonetheless has an ugly ass swing and hands of clay. MJ is a manifestly inelegant golfer. Other than basketball and, maybe, high jumping, long jumping or triple jumping, could MJ excel at any other sport?

OTOH, it seems that most NHL players and MLB pitchers retire and are low handicap golfers within a year or two.

Actually Jordan played varsity football and baseball in high school. He didn't make varsity in basketball until his senior year. The primary point was that baseball, at least as far as hitting major league pitching, is very hard. If you can give a single example of someone who has learned how to do this in a year or two, I'm unaware of it. Jordan is just an example of a 'pretty good' athlete who never learned how to do it.

[plugboots]

For the second criteria, one of the main considerations is 'depth/size of talent pool', i.e. how many people compete/participate in the sport seriously. For my taste, the 'most difficult' sport using this criteria is soccer (football for non-gringos). Although there are a lot of skiers, the number of 'serious' skiers is pretty small compared to soccer, basketball, running, etc.

It cracks me up that Pele wasn't on espn's list, as I consider him one of the greatest athletes of all time.
[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SportsCentury[/ame]

Morons.

[GeezerSteve]

If you can give a single example of someone who has learned how to do this in a year or two, I'm unaware of it.

Jim Thorpe learned to hit major league pitching after playing very little baseball.

Sportscentury was limited to American (and, apparently some Canadian) athletes so Pele, Eddy Merckx, Emile Zapotek and Paavo Nurmi were not in the running. It was a joke. Naming MJ as the greatest 20th Century American athlete is a prime example of recency bias. If cultural importance and dominance in a culturally powerful sport were the keystones, then Babe Ruth (#2) was a sound choice.

But in terms of pure atheticsm, Babe Didrikson Zaharias and Jim Thorpe should have been #1 and #2. Those two were world class at every sport they attempted. Babe was a scratch golfer within 6 months of being introduced to the sport. She was a bizarrely gifted athlete, a champion in numerous sports. Olympic gold medal winner in hurdles and javelin, would have wond gold in the high jump if the Fosbury Flop had been legal back then, world class discus and long jump, 3X All-American in basketball, world record baseball throw, best golfer of her time and won some majors (including a US Open when she was dying of cancer), expert at diving, bowling, tennis, roller skating, archery and more.

[garyfromterrace]

See the definition of sport in my prior post.

Now, read carefully: The terms sport and game are not mutually exclusive. Some sports are games, e.g., football, baseball, soccer, golf. A sport is also a game if the sport is conducted as a competition with rules. When the competitors are measured by elapsed time, the competitive event is called a race. Some sports sometimes take the form of races, e.g., alpine skiing, nordic skiing, running.

Some, but not all, games are sports. Some, but not all, racing events are sports. Some sports are neither games nor races.

And there is no apostrophe in tons, the plural form of ton, which is sometimes used in colloquial fashion to mean "many."

nice work with the dictionary. my bad with the uncorrected typo, thank you though for the eye on the grammar. Oh, and for providing a considerable amount of grey to a discussion that could be a fun black and white discussion. My attempt at throwing in Hemmingway (or not Hemmingway - better check that fact too einstein) was to lighten the discussion with a black and white view from a talented old drunk.

Big Steve you're probably right though, but still

edit: hehe stevieboy, there`s no `d`in won.

ps you`re right about Thorpe

[GeezerSteve]

No dictionary. I walk around with this shit in my head.

[toast2266]

Baseball is Not easy. Hitting a round ball with a round bat is extremely hard to do. Especially if that round ball is traveling over 90 mph. Even the best hitters fail 70% of the time.

So there's one aspect of baseball that makes it mildly difficult, but yet the baseball powers that be have provided an easy out (bunt!)

Of course, with the bunt, its considerably harder for the tub of lard to haul his fat ass 90 feet quick enough. At least he gets to retire to the dugout and continue to sit around with a chew in.

What a fucking awesome sport.

[Relico]

There are great skiers who have no athletic ability and most athletes are terrible skiers. Athletics really dont matter and athletic ability doesnt translate into a skill set like this.

[Sessiøn]

Is this the same Lance Armstrong who runs 2h45min marathons, just for fun?

EPO is a helluva drug.