Praxis Powder 185 reviews?

**BigLineSeeker** · 02-14-2007, 12:40 PM

or sell me the Praxis

**jibco** · 02-14-2007, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by JeffreyJim

Will do. Leaving work right now...

Yeah Jeff, didn't you hear? We got snow.

*grumbles about work*

**Walter Sobchak** · 02-15-2007, 12:55 PM

I got a windfall bonus check at work last month and decided to fill the powder niche in my quiver. I settled on the Praxis pretty quickly for a couple of reasons -- good reviews, good price, local indy company, cool graphics, and I didn't just want another fat ski, I wanted to see what reverse camber and reverse sidecut skied like.

First task: bending 104 mm Rossi brakes out to 137 mm. I wanted the job done right, which for me means finding someone else with the time, skills, and tools to do it. A friend of a friend referred me to a metalworker in Hunter's Point. My first time in the neighborhood. There's a stretch of several blocks that smelled strongly of menthol each of the four times I drove through.

Firing up the acetylene blowtorch and hammering them flat:

Adding the new bend. To shield the plastic parts from the heat, he used some kind of insulation from the inside of an old kiln, said it was toxic crap and told me to take shallow breaths. I asked if it was asbestos -- he said "probably worse," laughed, and breathed deeply:

Great work:

I mounted 98 cm back.

Next task: a big dump and time off to ski it, which was delivered Fri-Mon at Kirkwood. I can't say the Praxis are "best in class" since they're the only ski of this type I've tried, but I'm a believer in the concept and the execution and these will be my ride for almost all 6" plus resort powder days. I'll still break out the Explosivos for some post-powder crud and wind buff days.

There was no learning curve in soft snow. In heavy powder they were faster, more effortless, and more maneuverable than anything I've ever skied. The way they carried speed through cement on the flats was amazing.

What I found most surprising was how normally they skied in lighter fresh snow, like in the upper third of Palisades Sunday. I wasn't, as I feared I might be, just planing on top like on a snowboard. Knee deep was still knee deep and I got face shots in deeper pockets. Small drops (as big as I go 'cause I'm brittle like your grandma's hips) were a breeze.

They were fun in Monday's wind buff too. I kinda missed the energy of camber and the cleaner arc of sidecut, but I liked never having to think about crust or variable conditions. The Praxis plowed over everything.

Groomers: Fine when there's pitch and the snow's soft. Once you get the backwards logic -- forward-center in powder, center-back on groomers -- you can sort of make them carve. Every now and then on flat terrain, especially when in a tuck, I'd instinctively get forward to go faster and a ski would shoot out in the wrong direction. Oops ...

Traverses: This is where I nearly wrecked myself. Zooming along on the low goat track to Pali on Saturday, there was one bend to the left with a little branch sticking out to the right. I instinctively pressured the front of the skis ... right ski shoots out to the right ... tip hooks the branch ... trucking through the trees on one ski with the other leg out in the air behind me. Oops ... After that I started paying attention and it never happened again.

I can't wait to try them out in late spring slop too -- they could be a great post-Memorial Day Chair 23 ski. If I get another windfall bonus I'm mounting a pair tele. If I get a third windfall bonus and mild brain damage, Dynafits. If I get a fourth windfall bonus, I'll finally sign up to take the "How to Plan for Your Financial Future and Stop Being a Gear-Hoarding Yuppie Douchebag" seminar I can never quite save up for.

**kidwoo** · 02-15-2007, 01:01 PM

Nice write up WS.

So that was you skiing with Supu (and me eventually?).

Cool......now I know who to bug to bend my brakes for mine

**smolakian** · 02-15-2007, 01:15 PM

I bent my look P12 brakes myself. WAAAAY harder than bending Solly brakes. The outcome was quite hilarious. I'll post some pics when I get a chance.

**JeffreyJim** · 02-15-2007, 04:18 PM

FINALLY

Just got back from skiing a this morning at Berthoud. Here is my real review.

Skier: 6'2" 195
Snow:7-14" New/Windblown softness, crunchy underneath
Terrain: BP
Binding: Solomon 977
Mount: Suggested line
Other Skis: Scratch BC/FS, B4, a few K2s and Lines too
Backround: Everything. Skiing for 10 years, Snowboard then I was younger, Downhill mountain bike racing

Finally got to break these guys out in the right situation. I had already skied them at Jackson two days after a couple of small storms and also had a day on them at Mary Jane in which was less than ideal. Today was the first day where I started to realize the skis' potential on about 7" of creamy windblown snow at Berthoud.

Overall: The ski is fun as hell. Simply put it has added a whole new element to skiing soft snow. Once you learn to trust the ski you can arch any radius turn in just about any sort of SOFT snow. You can slash, smear, pivot...whatever. The previous reviewers are right, the heavier the snow the more the ski shines, cuts through heavier wind affected snow without hooking/diving. You can surf just about any kind of arch you want. I learned to make sure and keep your center of gravity low, stay centered on the balls of your feet and just turn your brain off. Through trees you can flow tight lines FAST (you don't realize it until you think about your speed) You do have to get agressive and trust the ski. Yet to hit any bigger airs or REAL deep days...time will tell.

Skinning with these wasn't that bad. Yes, I use Trekkers. No, I don't skin for much longer than 30 minutes on these. I found them to break trail nicely however, being the skins were cut for Scratch BCs (narrower under foot) and the ski is reverse camber, it doesn't take much of an incline/slick skin track to make the ski want to fall backwards. If you're breaking trail this isn't a problem, if you are following an old track and it gets steep you really weight the ski correctly. Traversing is just a pain...but worth it if conditions are there.

Through groomed stuff it's okay. I have other skis to mach groomers and arch turns. That's not what these were made for and I'm okay with it. They are manageable and kind of fun actually.

In variable/crud is where I have the most improvement to make on the ski. At first I got destroyed in conditions that were kind of soft, but not consistent (chop/skied out stuff). I know there is a way, it'll just take some time to learn the ski a little more.

Skiing soft bumps was also an area where these were "less than ideal". I know, there are other skis for that, but I ski a lot of days at Mary Jane and like trying to ski these in most any conditions. Most days I'll just take out my Scratch BCs in these conditions but I think there will be a few days where I'll find some good turns on these skis too.

Construction of the ski so far has been bomber. I hit two rocks mid arch today (I was pinned and REAALLLY laying out a turn) Any ski I've ever been on before it would have been a core shot. These, just a bit of PTex...nothing else. BOMBER!

Overall they are fun, playful ski. I still have a lot I want to figure out/try on them. From the looks of it, they'll stomp airs and easier than expected to spin (the mount is actually sort of forward/swing weight feels LIGHT) More to come for sure....

**Walter Sobchak** · 02-15-2007, 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by kidwoo

Nice write up WS.

So that was you skiing with Supu (and me eventually?).

Cool......now I know who to bug to bend my brakes for mine

Yep, that was me! Nice to put a face and a name with another board name. Get those planks mounted before the next storm ... I recommend Sierra Ski and Cycle Works on Lake Tahoe Blvd., near the Safeway.

Also, something to add to myreview: I hit a bunch of rocks, nothing full on at really high speeds, but the bases, edges, and sidewalls held up just fine.

**kidwoo** · 02-15-2007, 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by Walter Sobchak

Yep, that was me! Nice to put a face and a name with another board name. Get those planks mounted before the next storm ... I recommend Sierra Ski and Cycle Works on Lake Tahoe Blvd., near the Safeway.

Also, something to add to myreview: I hit a bunch of rocks, nothing full on at really high speeds, but the bases, edges, and sidewalls held up just fine.

Yeah nice skiing with you man.

I'm just going to get the guys at alpine to mount them. I'm on the northshore and they've done a bunch of them at this point.

See you next storm day.........with our matching feet

**astropaulo** · 02-18-2007, 05:03 PM

Just mounted up my praxis for tele and I was wondering if others have noticed how far forward the mounting point seens. I haven't skied the spats so I don't know if this is the norm for this type of ski.

**sfotex** · 02-18-2007, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by astropaulo

Just mounted up my praxis for tele and I was wondering if others have noticed how far forward the mounting point seens. I haven't skied the spats so I don't know if this is the norm for this type of ski.

It works fine. Trust me. Be sure to stay centered and high when you're slaying the pow with your new sticks. Thos isn't your dads surfy backseat skis.

**frorider** · 02-18-2007, 09:22 PM

sfotex, i thought your tele mount put your boot midsole about 3 cm behind the red line on the praxis topsheet, right?

my telemount is -2.5 relative to the topsheet red line. i still have no complaints about that location. tele turns are telepathic in soft snow with this mount .

the recent 4 footer sunday at kirkwood was a good time to be on the praxis. deep and moist untracked sierra pow is dead easy to ski at any speed on these.

the volkswagen-sized bumps were fine too...pivot turn at the crest, no biggie.

however the snow was wet enough down low that day that i had to keep my speed moderate on some of the lower groomers. there were weird ruts formed by the wet snow that made the ski track strangely at times.

**astropaulo** · 02-18-2007, 11:20 PM

My pin line is at 83.8. Yours is at 83 right frorider?

**sfotex** · 02-19-2007, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by frorider

sfotex, i thought your tele mount put your boot midsole about 3 cm behind the red line on the praxis topsheet, right?
......
however the snow was wet enough down low that day that i had to keep my speed moderate on some of the lower groomers. there were weird ruts formed by the wet snow that made the ski track strangely at times.

I ended up with my boot BC -3cm begind the red line. The ski is shaped differently then other skis, so this mount might look strange compared to a regular shaped ski, but this isn't a regular ski. My BC ended up at 99cm from the tip, tape pulled tight.

That wet snow that forms up later in the day at the bottom of the resorts in Tahoe always seemed to be wierd and grabby on the edges no matter what I was skiing on.

**frorider** · 02-19-2007, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by sfotex

That wet snow that forms up later in the day at the bottom of the resorts in Tahoe always seemed to be wierd and grabby on the edges no matter what I was skiing on.

actually no, the snow at the lower elevations was okay ...my big daddies or monsters would have had no issues at all in those conditions. 'course i'm used to those conditions.

it's no biggie. the praxis is still more versatile than I would have expected.

**altasnob** · 02-24-2007, 10:36 PM

Finally got the Praxis out in some good conditions today at Crystal. 30" new in the past week with about a foot falling on top of that today. Very light for the PNW. I've gone through 20+ skis in my life and have witnessed a steady improvement throughout the years. I've always thought the most dramatic change came when I purchased my first fat ski, going from K2 slalom race skis to the Dynastar 4x4 BIGs in 1999. That may have changed today moving from Seth Pistols to the Praxis. I could charge hard without the slightest edge catch and change directions on a dime. I say change directions rather than turning because that is really what it is. Much more of a snowboarder style of attacking the mountain. Even in packed out (but still soft) pow, they outperformed any traditional sidecut ski I've ridden. Without the sidecut, they are hard to rail across the mountain quickly but in powder, who wants to be railing big slow turns. On groomers, cat-tracks, and traverses, the sketch factor was pretty minimal but they are more tiring and slow (especially to skate and side step).

I mounted em with Naxo 21s, which are working great. I've already toured on them and if the snow is soft, I don't notice any decrease in touring performance from my old setup (Seths and Naxo 01s). They don't even weigh that much more.

I mounted them 98.5 cm from the tip (1.5 cm farther back than the recommended line). The drawback to a back mount should be that they are harder to turn but they were the easiest skis to turn in powder I've ever ridden. And despite the back mount, I still had to ride in my typical back seat powder stance (but this may have been because the snow was so deep). Oh, and I'm 6', 175 lbs.

Overall, a phenomenal powder ski and highly recommended.

**lax** · 02-24-2007, 10:58 PM

this thread is worth less without pics

**funkendrenchman** · 02-25-2007, 02:27 AM

Originally Posted by altasnob

I mounted them 98.5 cm from the tip (1.5 cm farther back than the recommended line). The drawback to a back mount should be that they are harder to turn but they were the easiest skis to turn in powder I've ever ridden. And despite the back mount, I still had to ride in my typical back seat powder stance (but this may have been because the snow was so deep). Oh, and I'm 6', 175 lbs.

Try to stay more centered... that's how they were meant to be ridden, even in the deepest of deep snow.

**sfotex** · 02-25-2007, 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by lax

this thread is worth less without pics

http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=77840

**JeffreyJim** · 02-25-2007, 06:04 PM

Am I the only one who didn't grab these and just start killing it? They are fun, no doubts there but I'm still not convinced they are better. Maybe I need to open my mind a little or read a reverse camber/sidecut ski "how to" book.

Like I said, fun? YES, Better? Not sure yet.

Any thread where I can find out more about what I should change fundementally to start riding these a little better?

**Blurred** · 02-25-2007, 07:24 PM

Originally Posted by JeffreyJim

Am I the only one who didn't grab these and just start killing it? They are fun, no doubts there but I'm still not convinced they are better. Maybe I need to open my mind a little or read a reverse camber/sidecut ski "how to" book.

Like I said, fun? YES, Better? Not sure yet.

Any thread where I can find out more about what I should change fundementally to start riding these a little better?

Reverse camber skis rule in imperfect snow, and trees. If you haven't skied them in trees, you have no idea.

**fat yeti** · 02-25-2007, 08:02 PM

I agree with blurred about the trees. I finaly got mine on some great snow ate the bird. The first run I though they were good, but the third run on gad 2 they killed it through the trees. It does take some time to get used to them I have been on mine on wind effected snow and powder and crud. For powder they are great and for crud they are a lot better than the prophet 130s but on the groomed they can be scarry but they were better the first day on the softer groomed snow. Traversing sucks, I am going to wax these before the next time out on powder but they are slow on traverses. They are the best powder ski I have been on and they can hold any turn shape in the powder and crud.

**altasnob** · 02-25-2007, 10:08 PM

I really think they excel in Cascade concrete/Sierra Cement. Not as much of a difference when you are skiing Utah/Colorado blower.

**flip** · 02-26-2007, 03:48 PM

Finally got on mine yesterday while stranded at Kirkwood. 5'8" 165, points of reference for pow skis are two runs on spats in cut up powder (didn't like 'em), and a season or so on my axioms (meh, they worked, but I didn't love them). Tend to like softer skis, more rebound than damp, and more turny than not (exception being explosives). Conditions were a foot of heavy, wind-packed powder over about 2 feet of cut up heavy powder.

Expected to not like them. Liked them a lot. Best snow was in the trees and it was too windy to access anything steep. Normally would have been totally bogged down and unable to turn. These ripped through everything. I love trees, and I really love picking my way between tight trees blindly... these made that so effortless it was ridiculous. I've never been able to make those surfy little non-turn wiggles that boarders do in powder. Never even thought to before these skis, and now they're easy. Also way faster in powder than anything else I've been on, and it's so nice to be able to stay centered or even drive the tips in powder even on low angles and low speeds. In variable conditions (say, only 4" over firm where it had blown off) they sucked and I would much rather be on a normal ski, but the trees made it worth it to have them on my feet. I also normally like short skis, and these are the shortest skiing sticks I own.

So far I'm sold. Maybe only a pow-day ski, but I'm psyched to have them in my quiver. If I had to guess on what would make them better, it would be a slightly wider tip and a touch less rocker, so I could actually feel myself flexing the things and play with the turn shape a bit.

Also, they're super light mounted with Rossi 150 Pros, and the lakeview topsheet is purdy.

And if anyone finds a beat-up Nokia in the Kwood parking lot, the only thing of value about it is a number for "Christina."

**flip** · 02-26-2007, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by BlurredElevens

Reverse camber skis rule in imperfect snow

Didn't like spats in chop and cut up pow, and didn't like the Praxis on shallow powder over firm. Could see them being awesome in crusty conditions though.

**kidwoo** · 02-26-2007, 03:59 PM

Originally Posted by flip

the only thing of value about it is a number for "Christina."

Yeah no kidding.

We're meeting up for some drinks tonight.

And since you don't consider my number valuable, I'm gonna put it in her pooper.

Oh yeah.....praxis review.......they're really fun to boink off of little rock drops in a row.