BRING BACK THE EXPLOSIV!!

**MOHSHSIHd** · 09-25-2006, 09:28 PM

still kicking myself for not picking up those never mounted wizards I saw in the shop a couple years ago for like 300....

**HitMe** · 09-26-2006, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by gforce

My 2 Cents: Explosiv/Mantra Comparison.
The Mantra is a nice ski but Volkl labeling it as the Explosiv replacement is a bit of a stretch - maybe they should have called it Exlplosiv Lite. I expected it to have the same power with the claimed wood/2 layers of titanal construction. Flexing the two is really different as the Mantra is considerably softer. But the killer is the mounting point - the Mantra has a much more centered mounting point and the ski hinges completely different. Get off an Explosiv and jump on a Mantra and think about turning and you have already done it. You don't have to drive it like the Explosiv - which for me is part of the appeal of the Explosiv - knowing you can blast through anything without the ski faltering - totally predictable. Volkl made the Mantra much more user friendly but watered down the traditional Volkl ride a bit...not a bad thing but to me very different. I would like to try skiing a Mantra with a -2 mount though.

I wouldn't say the traditional Völkl ride is watered down in the Mantra. Even with Völkl standards, the Explosive is kind of special. However, I agree with the rest of your analysis. Actually (and I forgot to mentions this in my first post in this thread), I have my Mantras mounted 1.5-2 cm back and wouldn't for my life mount them more forwards. The standard mounting point on the Explosives is something like 6 centimeters further back than the standard mounting point of the Mantra (comparing relative running surface). I don't think you can go that far back on the Mantra though since you will run into problems controlling the turnier tip.

To Yo Eddie (I just saw a FaTChance Yo Eddie pedal by the other day btw): Going for more stiffness in the original Explosive could have been an option, but I actually think the reasonably soft tip is a great asset to the ski. It provides some damping when you hit stuff that you simply cant power right through. With a stiffer tip you would mabye gain even more ability to power through things but loose this damping and probably also a bit of feel in the powder.

**YoEddy** · 09-26-2006, 05:19 AM

Originally Posted by HitMe

Going for more stiffness in the original Explosive could have been an option, but I actually think the reasonably soft tip is a great asset to the ski. It provides some damping when you hit stuff that you simply cant power right through. With a stiffer tip you would mabye gain even more ability to power through things but loose this damping and probably also a bit of feel in the powder.

My original comment was a response to someone else asking for more tip - I thought they meant a stiffer tip, not sidecut. I guess I can understand why some would want more sidecut (hey, it's a SG ... sack up and go faster!), but I don't see why you'd want/need a stiffer tip than it already has.

But ... "Relatively soft tip"?!? Compared to what!? They're fricking bulldozers ... there is nothing that "you can't power through" with this ski!

**HitMe** · 09-26-2006, 06:24 AM

Originally Posted by YoEddy

My original comment was a response to someone else asking for more tip - I thought they meant a stiffer tip, not sidecut. I guess I can understand why some would want more sidecut (hey, it's a SG ... sack up and go faster!), but I don't see why you'd want/need a stiffer tip than it already has.

But ... "Relatively soft tip"?!? Compared to what!? They're fricking bulldozers ... there is nothing that "you can't power through" with this ski!

OK. As for the tip, well everything is relative, but it not lik the tip is super stiff, at least not later versions of the ski. The tail is fairly stiff though and the flex patterns is very smooth. I wouldn't call it super stiff overall either, and I think lots of the "power though ability" comes from the combinations of damped character and how the flex gradually softens up towards the tip. It kind of adds up to a ski that absorbs a lot of energy when you power though stuff but still feed enough information through.

In any case, I think we agree its a GREAT ski.

**gforce** · 09-26-2006, 06:59 AM

Hit Me - So you mounted it 1.5 - 2.0 back and it doesn't feel over turny compared to the Explosiv? My buddies Mantra felt overy turny coming off my Explosivs - hence the watered down ride comment.

**HitMe** · 09-26-2006, 07:52 AM

gforce: When you step on the explosive after the Mantra you definitely have to think about entering the turn actively to get the ski to do anything (second nature when you only ride explosive). So, there is no question the Mantra pulls you into a carve way more actively. So, there is no doubt that if you skid the Explosive and Mantre in the same way, the Mantra will give you a smaller radius carve (in any kind of semi solid conditions). I wouldn't call it over turning though. If you by "over turning" relate to the feel when the ski sort of want to carve in under you when you rail them up, I don't get that with the Mantras. They are really solid in this respect. If you relate to "pushing through" the softer flexing Mantras so you loose accelleration in the turn I don't get this with the Mantras either (but I don't like the Kamras at all because of that they start to wander and can't take decent pressure in a turn without flexing too much underfoot and hence loose speed). IN my opinion, the (2cm back mounted) Mantra is still a fast and very grippy ski, just like the Explosive and I think the Mantra gives feedback to the skier in a similar way. I don't mind the extra turniness as such but as I wrote above this comes at the price of a more nervous ride when you loose grip and you don't get the same security with the Mantras in such situations. In fresh pow, especially in the trees, I like the Mantra because even 2cm back, you're still much more centered over the ski and can react faster and the wider tip still won't dive.

**gforce** · 09-26-2006, 02:16 PM

Hit Me - Good Analysis. I would have to agree with what you are saying. The only time the explosiv gives me trouble is in steep trees, firm conditions with bumps. The ski will sometimes accelerate away from you because you are making slower turns and can't set them up like you can in wider open spaces. If the snow is looser then no problem. This is where the I think the Mantra will shine. One day, last year it forced me to ski the trees super fast and my buddies asked why - mainley because I needed to force them up on edge at speed.

**Arty50** · 09-26-2006, 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by kidwoo

Do you have one with boobies?

Does this work? (.)(.)

**skiitsbetter** · 09-26-2006, 05:22 PM

Originally Posted by HitMe

gforce: When you step on the explosive after the Mantra you definitely have to think about entering the turn actively to get the ski to do anything (second nature when you only ride explosive). So, there is no question the Mantra pulls you into a carve way more actively. So, there is no doubt that if you skid the Explosive and Mantre in the same way, the Mantra will give you a smaller radius carve (in any kind of semi solid conditions). I wouldn't call it over turning though. If you by "over turning" relate to the feel when the ski sort of want to carve in under you when you rail them up, I don't get that with the Mantras. They are really solid in this respect. If you relate to "pushing through" the softer flexing Mantras so you loose accelleration in the turn I don't get this with the Mantras either (but I don't like the Kamras at all because of that they start to wander and can't take decent pressure in a turn without flexing too much underfoot and hence loose speed). IN my opinion, the (2cm back mounted) Mantra is still a fast and very grippy ski, just like the Explosive and I think the Mantra gives feedback to the skier in a similar way. I don't mind the extra turniness as such but as I wrote above this comes at the price of a more nervous ride when you loose grip and you don't get the same security with the Mantras in such situations. In fresh pow, especially in the trees, I like the Mantra because even 2cm back, you're still much more centered over the ski and can react faster and the wider tip still won't dive.

How would you compare a Mantra to a Head Monster 88?

**ulty_guy** · 01-03-2007, 03:36 AM

just to bump this and add fuel to the fire. i've loved my 180 cmh's that i've beat to crap (but fortunately scored a very lightly used pair of exp 2's from german ebay for reasonable cash and then the seller threw in some g4's for like 75 euros

). anyhoo, on to my point...

i for some reason like a very weird assortment of dissimilar skis: 180 explosivs; zags; 174 1080 guns; 186 lps; etc. so i tried the mantras in a 177 and thought they were boring as hell and skied like everything else out there. the thing that i love about the explosiv is that so few skis feel like it, it has some ethereal.

i guess i have another question at the end of this...i have a pair of unmounted 183 gotamas from last year (explosiv shape, not the new ones). will i like these as much as my explosivs? i don't see the reason to ski a twin that has to be mounted so far back, but i think it'd be blastphamy to chop the tail off.

**Jr.M** · 01-03-2007, 04:22 AM

Just got me few weeks ago those red Explosivs with buddhas in 190 and in mint condition. Put R8 telebindings on them to the holes drilled by prev owner and went skiing.

The skis were ok but didn't feel solid enough in the hard slopes after Big Daddies and had some trouble getting them dialled in to turns, felt also some wandering there in the middle of it. Compared to the other skis I have that also have bindings a bit forward than recommended -> The mounting point of the Exps felt as it'd be too damn rear as my boot size is quite big. So transferred front pieces of the R8s 2,5cm (~1") forward and the skis started to rule in hard slopes and some mixed snow conditions away from the slopes. The skis felt much easier to turn and solid in soft moguls in the middle of hard slope. Couldn't find a speed limit for the skis even if tried hard. Sometimes still felt that the really stiff tail is cousing some troubles in tight spots since not getting the skis to turn so fast as needed..

Anyways, had a nice 2 days with them during new years trip, the skis seem burly enough and very predictable to ski esp in not so good snow conditions. I think can understand now how Exps got the reputation. Still waiting to ski it more but decided allready that gonna keep it in my quiver for sure. Perhaps it would be nice to try also Mantras and compare the the skis a little..

**ptex1** · 01-03-2007, 08:00 AM

mounting points. I own a shop and the volkl rep suggested and we mount all of our Mantras 1.5 cm back. as for the question comparing the manntra to the im 88 from Head. i am a volkl fanatic and i own the head and the volkl and im not sure which i like better. Both of these skis simply rip!
I also believe if a shop orders 250 pairs of a ski Volkl will make it. So get me 250 buyers and ill get the explosive back

**ulty_guy** · 01-03-2007, 08:20 AM

buyer #1

**Idris** · 01-03-2007, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by ptex1

I also believe if a shop orders 250 pairs of a ski Volkl will make it. So get me 250 buyers and ill get the explosive back

I heard this when working in Banff. But now that Volkl is part of K2 group I don't think it's true anymore. Also CMH wanted more of the origional design ones (volkl tried a slightly modified one for production reasons and they ALL delamed) and have now gone with Atomic like their arch rivals Mike Wiggly.

I was told Volkl stoped making the Explosive because of low number but also because they were a pig to make compared to other skis - they were a lot more labour intensive and the process required more skill.

If however somone could get the copyright or just permision to copy the explosive. Having them made (making a small volume production line) would not be impossible.

**ulty_guy** · 01-03-2007, 08:44 AM

Originally Posted by Idris

....Having them made (making a small volume production line) would not be impossible.

impossible? i think it'd be unpossible!

**Tony** · 01-03-2007, 11:02 AM

FWIW, Buyer #2.

**Tony** · 01-03-2007, 11:07 AM

Originally Posted by ulty_guy

i have a pair of unmounted 183 gotamas from last year (explosiv shape, not the new ones). will i like these as much as my explosivs?

Yes, you will. It's an excellent ski.

Originally Posted by ulty_guy

i don't see the reason to ski a twin that has to be mounted so far back

One word: roostertails.

**Jr.M** · 01-03-2007, 11:37 AM

Hey I live in the other side of this rock but what the hell. Buyer #3..

(and in 190cm lenght please)

**ptex1** · 01-03-2007, 11:42 AM

I know this will sound crazy but their has been an exodus of some of volkls big guns to Blizzard. The tecnica group bought blizzard in october. One of my friends from volkl just made the move and the head of Volkl Germany made the move to blizzard, as well as the US product manager just moved to blizzard. these guys would be the company to bring it back with a new name. ill ask when i meet with them.

**laseranimal** · 01-03-2007, 11:45 AM

PM Gear guys to the white courtesy phone.............

PM Gear guys to the white courtesy phone.............

Thank you

**ulty_guy** · 01-03-2007, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by ptex1

I know this will sound crazy but their has been an exodus of some of volkls big guns to Blizzard. The tecnica group bought blizzard in october. One of my friends from volkl just made the move and the head of Volkl Germany made the move to blizzard, as well as the US product manager just moved to blizzard. these guys would be the company to bring it back with a new name. ill ask when i meet with them.

DOOOOO IT!

there's gotta be some of those boys that loved the exploder.

**SkiN00d** · 01-03-2007, 03:03 PM

I'd buy 3 pair. Does the 250 pair have to be all the same size or could we get, say, 50 170s, and 100 each of the 180s & 190s. Would we want a custom top sheet or can we all agree on wizards?

**hemas** · 01-03-2007, 03:18 PM

Shit, I'd be in for two pairs... one in 190 and one in 180...

**jibco** · 01-03-2007, 03:59 PM

I recently picked up some budha sploders from pechleman and I'm totally in love. Simply charge everything. Considering stocking up on backup pairs.

Also considering putting FR's on a pair of 180s. Any reason not to?'

The idea of getting Blizzard to make a rep. is pretty interesting. I'd hope they could do it justice.