Traveling w ABS to Japan

[ski whore]

Did some searching but couldn't find anything- anyone have some help on flying w an ABS pack from US to Japan?

[Gnartu]

you will have to discharge the air canisters before taking them on a plane.

[b dubya]

look up the 'dangerous goods' rules for each airline you will be flying, it should be spelled out there. Check each airline as some may be more restrictive. If worried, print the relevant page to ask any curious check in staff.

[neck beard]

ABS pack from US to Japan?

Just for your info, to the best of my knowledge you will not be able to fill it here in Japan.

[Gunder]

I've had no issue's smuggling mine in... goes to show how worthless TSA actually is. However, you will not succeed in getting it back out if you are flying to the US. IF you are flying elsewhere then no problem. Security at Narita is very by the book and nothing gets past them. Even oversided camera batteries without proper paper work.

There is ZERO support for ABS in Japan as the triggers are not allowed in Japan.

[hop]

IIRC, as of last year you couldn't get BCA canisters re-filled in Japan unless you had a canister that you bought in Japan, and even then it was only refillable at that shop.

Like Gunder I had success smuggling a full BCA canister in, but when it came time to get out I had to discharge mine at the airport. Gunder had to hand over his ABS canister (actually, I handed it over for him).

ABS = one shot deals right? Discharging one before your flight wouldn't do you much good then.

http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...h-Airbag-packs

[ski whore]

Thx for the beta...what about shipping an ABS pack via FedEx or DHL?

[spar]

You are flying with a Lifejacket/PFD (Personal Flotation Device) that in emergency floats you in cold powdery H2O. uses the same cylinders as marine systems.

The International Aviation Regulations under IATA state that airline passengers are allowed to fly with an inflatable life jacket and up to two spare C0² cylinders per life jacket. However individual airlines can overrule these regulations with their own safety regulations and prevent passengers from taking cylinders on board.

Go to the TSA website and print out the page that describes allowing of CO2 in PFDs. Then go to the airline website of whichever airline you're flying. It will either have it's own policy allowing PFDs, or it will just refer you to TSA policy. Print that page out too. Bring the printed pages with you, and when the TSA doesn't know what to do, just show him the printouts. Worse case, he'll call a manager over who will let you through.

TSA Rules: Small compressed gas cartridges (Up to 2 in life vests and 2 spares. The spares must accompany the life vests and presented as one unit)
Carry-on? OK Checked? OK

[DasBlunt]

Thx for the beta...what about shipping an ABS pack via FedEx or DHL?

I thought it was Hazard ground shipping only.

[neck beard]

IIRC, as of last year you couldn't get BCA canisters re-filled in Japan unless you had a canister that you bought in Japan, and even then it was only refillable at that shop.

I think that is still the case. The only cannister you can get filled in Japan is a BCA canister and only if it was bought in Japan and it can only be refilled at their facility. This is because BCA spent the time and money to meet the regulatory requirements of scuba tanks.

Some possibly inaccurate background: to get a scuba tank filled in Japan you need a license to own it. When you buy a BCA pack in Japan it comes with a licence. They put in a lot of effort to achieve that.

Basically, if you have an empty canister in Japan of any type, you are not getting it refilled unless it is a BCA bought in Japan.

And unlike the US and Canada where inexplicably there are dive shops in every mountain and rural rown. In Japan, there are very very few. And no paintball. And the firestation guys would be very unlikely to do it.

= Black Diamond JetForce.

[Gunder]

Thx for the beta...what about shipping an ABS pack via FedEx or DHL?

Not an option. I looked into it, and there is no way its getting threw customs into Japan. Not only are the canisters not allowed, but the "explosive" triggered handles are a big no-no in Japan as well. Best to smuggle it in your luggage.

[llyon]

I've flown into and out of japan the past 3 years w a full abs canister. Haven't been stopped yet. As others have mentioned you are not allowed to fly w full abs canisters in either the USA or Japan and you can't refill canisters in japan. If you are in hakuba we may have a couple extra canisters around

[Wangta]

I think that is still the case. The only cannister you can get filled in Japan is a BCA canister and only if it was bought in Japan and it can only be refilled at their facility. This is because BCA spent the time and money to meet the regulatory requirements of scuba tanks.

Some possibly inaccurate background: to get a scuba tank filled in Japan you need a license to own it. When you buy a BCA pack in Japan it comes with a licence. They put in a lot of effort to achieve that.

Basically, if you have an empty canister in Japan of any type, you are not getting it refilled unless it is a BCA bought in Japan.

And unlike the US and Canada where inexplicably there are dive shops in every mountain and rural rown. In Japan, there are very very few. And no paintball. And the firestation guys would be very unlikely to do it.

= Black Diamond JetForce.

Neck beard et al - thanks so much for hitting on this topic. I'm headed to Japan next month and have been doing research on a avalanche backpack. I was focusing more on features and had widdled my selection down to ABS...only to find that they are useless in Japan as you can't (1) legally get the cartridges into the country and (2) refill them if needed as ABS has zero network established (they use nitrogen!).

So I'm stuck with BCA, which isn't all bad. However, your post confused me. Do you have to BUY a BCA backpack + canister in Japan, or can I bring my BCA backpack to Japan, and BUY a Japanese BCA canister to use? Or do they only sell BCA canisters with new backpacks???

[neck beard]

However, your post confused me. Do you have to BUY a BCA backpack + canister in Japan, or can I bring my BCA backpack to Japan, and BUY a Japanese BCA canister to use? Or do they only sell BCA canisters with new backpacks???

Fair and relevant questions... that I can't accurately answer. There is a chance you can get away with just buying the canister in Japan and therefore qualifying for refill. I'd contact BCA in the States and ask them - they are the best people to find a definitive answer via their local contact.

[jennyboy]

@ llyon,

flying into japan in 10 days. planning on bringing my abs bag with one canister, which looks doable on air canada for the flight in. unfortunately i'm on united airlines on the way home and will not be able to take the cartridge/trigger. if you are around the hakuba area, maybe i can throw my canister your way or to another poor abs slog before i leave so other mags can use it? throw me a pm. good thread, hopefully restrictions change on these canisters soon.

[Wickedbrew4u]

I was just in Niseko and Rusutsu and saw tons of Aussies, Swedes and Norwegians with ABS bags. I asked and they said you can get a waiver for a full canister. I was super jealous. This definitely was the norm.

BCA does not have this option. I flew with an empty can and could not find a place to fill it up. I did however run into Bruce Edgerly (Co-Founder of BCA) and he was able to hook me up with a Japanese canister. They just got sanctioned over there so there are not alot of options of picking up a canister over there. FYI-The Japanese canister has a small release/burst valve on the side and is colored silver (required in JP).

If your in Niseko, the only place that might have a canister may be the Moiwa shop. They had quite a demo going on.

Have fun. Hokkaido is going off right now.

[Wickedbrew4u]

BTW all the euros and Aussies flew with the ABS's as a carry on.

[Meathelmet]

BTW all the euros and Aussies flew with the ABS's as a carry on.

Flown twice to jap with ABS canister as a carryon, no probs except once when flying back to scandihoovia.
Had all the papers with me & canister in the original container. They brought in the supervisor, a lot of nodding, smiles
and 5 minutes later I was off with the canister.

[jennyboy]

thx for the beta. sounds like air canada is no problem, but it's the us airline on the way out that won't let me fly with a full cannister. not sure if i can just fire it off, as there needs to be some way of "proving" it is discharged. maybe in security? . looks like i'll be skiing with it in japan, which is the more important thing.
do you guys just print the abs info off the website that states it complies with iata restrictions? is there another set of paperwork that i need to get my hands on?

[Dee Hubbs]

https://www.abs-airbag.com/us/abs-in-planes.html
ABS avalanche airbags are generally permitted aboard an aircraft according to the general rules of IATA (International Air Transport Association). However, as the IATA regulations are only a framework every airline and every country is free to pass stricter regulations.



ABS RENTAL STATIONS

You always have the option to bring your ABS backpack only and look for an ABS dealer at your destination who offers the rental of ABS cartridges and handles for the time of your stay. Here you can find an ABS dealer at your destination where you can rent an ABS backpack or an activation unit.

USA

The US American Transportation Safety Administration (TSA) will not allow your pressurized cartridge on board. Discharge (activate) the gas cartridge before entering the airport. Only once your cartridge is fully discharged, unscrew the cartridge head from the cartridge and put both in re-sealable plastic bags. Carry them through the TSA security checkpoint so they are visible to TSA personnel. Afterward, the cartridge head can be screwed back on the cartridge by hand. An ABS dealer at your destionation can replace the empty cartridge for a new one.



CANADA / REST OF THE WORLD

When flying to or from Canada (without stop in the US) we recommend that you inform the airline about the ABS TwinBag and provide the extract from the IATA table and the data sheet which describes the content of the cartridge and the activation handle (Download on the left side) before booking your flight.

It is very important that both the cartridge and activation handle are checked in together with the ABS TwinBag. Please print the section from the IATA table and the data sheet and attach them to your ABS backpack. This is to ensure that the purpose of the cartridge and backpack is obvious to the airport staff. If you check in the cartridge and activation handle separately, they may be confiscated!

Extract from the IATA table

"Avalanche rescue backpack, one (1) per person, containing a cylinder of compressed gas in Div. 2.2. May also be equipped with a pyrotechnic trigger mechanism containing less than 200 mg net of Div. 1.4S. The backpack must be packed in such a manner that it cannot be accidentally activated. The airbags within the backpacks must be fitted with pressure relief valves."

All ABS cartridges and activation handles starting from the double airbag models are compatible. For this reason, you also have the possibility to take your ABS backpack only and look for an ABS dealer who offers the rental of ABS cartridges and handles.

[buckyb]

Thanks everyone for all the info. I'm flying into Japan and going to Hakuba next week from the US on United. I read through United's dangerous goods (which is the same as TSA's) and the IATA and I don't see anywhere that you need to discharge the cartridge as everybody keeps saying. Am I missing this somewhere? I have a BCA pack, so it sounds like if I don't get the cartridge in my pack will be useless.

[hop]

http://www.backcountryaccess.com/201...#disqus_thread

There may be size limitations on the BCA canisters (290ml vs. 250ml). Rules are rules are rules, until/including when TSA/IATA is involved. As Wickedbrew4u and Neck Beard and I mentinoed - empty US-spec Float canisters are virtually impossible to fill in Japan due to Japanese laws. All I can say is print out every rule from every site saying you can travel with a full one and "good luck".

[1000-oaks]

thx for the beta. sounds like air canada is no problem, but it's the us airline on the way out that won't let me fly with a full cannister. not sure if i can just fire it off, as there needs to be some way of "proving" it is discharged. maybe in security? .

I would think popping off an ABS pack in security would prove the cylinder is empty if you fail to smuggle it through, and repacking the airbags only takes two minutes tops. Plus there's a hole in the little burst disc after the cylinder has been discharged, so it would be impossible for it to hold any pressure. (Though USA TSA likes to be able to see inside the cylinder, and the little hole isn't big enough for that.) The bang would certainly turn some heads though, and you might be scrutinized by the bomb sniffers after gunpowder residue from the trigger handle settles on your clothing.

As I recall pressurized cylinders for inflatable life vests are allowed, but they're smaller than airbag cylinders. Maybe packing the ABS cylinder with a life vest prop would get it through security, though they might wonder why it's so big and ask you to connect the cylinder to the vest.

[ski whore]

This is probably a shot in the dark but I am running out of ideas. Is anyone from Canada or Scandinavia going to be in Hokkaido anytime from feb 8-17 that would like to sell a full (sealed) canister and trigger. I would spend a hundred bucks if someone could make this happen- thx!

[userA]

as carry on it could be helpful.
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