Boycott Grenade Gloves

**Arty50** · 07-27-2010, 04:43 PM

Originally Posted by Gunder

While I personally think the photographer fucked up by not watermakering the image, I dont see where he screwed up past that. It is pretty common to show athletes the images after a shoot for there personal archives and for them to show there sponsors. Anyone that is involved in this industry for any period of time, should know and has no excuse to not realize that images need to be licensed from the creator not the athlete. Any legit athlete knows this too and should make sure there sponsors contact said creator. What is extra fucked is this company is built around its imagery, and the CEO has even bragged about them having a strong trademark... this IP is no different than a photographer enforcing ones copyright, so yes Grenade does and should know better.....

^ This. I took some photos of my AK camp with Gordy, and posted a thread on it here. Someone who writes a fairly simple newsletter on the East Coast contacted me here and asked for my permission to use one of the photos in her newletter. So if a simple newsletter publisher knows to ask for permission from an amateur photographer, then I damn well expect a company that deals with photos on a daily basis to know the same also.

Watermarked or not, Grenade should have found out who the photographer was and sought proper permission before using the photo. Period, end of story.

**theetruscan** · 07-27-2010, 04:54 PM

It seems like it's hard enough to be a professional ski photographer without these dicks.

What a class act that CEO seems to be. I'll definitely steer clear of Grenade going forward (though it's not that much of a sacrifice ... at all).

**blowupthemoon** · 07-27-2010, 05:26 PM

The shitbag CEO was gracious enough to reply to my complaints as well:

From: jc@grenadegloves.com
To: blowupthemoon
Subject: RE: thank you
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 22:27:27 +0000

It is amazing how much you can hate without hearing the whole story

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

From: blowupthemoon
Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 3:46 PM
To: JC <jc@grenadegloves.com>
Subject: RE: thank you

No, you'll truly be amazed come next season when no one buys anything with a grenade logo on it. Sorry chief but the burden of proof is on you to prove that you and your company did not actively try and screw over the photographer. If you tell me right now that you deny ever sending those e-mails that are plastered all over the web, then you might have a case, but we all know that you did.

Good luck in the market.

RE: thank you‏
From: JC (jc@grenadegloves.com)
Sent: Tue 7/27/10 5:16 PM
To: blowupthemoon

No thats not what i said, what i said is that is what he posted but he has been spoken to politely and legally over 7 months ago only you and the other complainers did not get those emails
Even the ones fron dustin they are not for public viewing he made the issue not us we 12 photograhers we use everyday of the week
We also have no problem paying but he wanted to push and threaten

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

From: blowupthemoon
Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 4:24 PM
To: JC <jc@grenadegloves.com>
Subject: RE: thank you

I don't know if anyone has said this, but it is damn near impossible to understand your e-mails. No offense but punctuation and proper grammar can go a long way, at least in my industry.

So you have no problem paying? Is this not your quote? "If it is business you want let me know if it is money please do not keep bothering me about this you know where I stand."

Chris has a diehard support base that is growing by the minute online. If you subscribe to the "any press is good press" mantra, then you're sorely mistaken. You can scream till you are blue in the face that you're the reasonable one and the evidence that exonerates you is "not for public viewing" but like I said before, the burden of proof is on you that Chris wasn't scammed by you and Grenade.

From: JC (jc@grenadegloves.com)
Sent: Tue 7/27/10 5:47 PM
To: blowupthemoon
Subject: RE: thank you

I am driving and using my phone while stuck in traffic.
My final question to you is who are you to him because i have gotten 3 emails and they all sound like you are you his friend?'

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

From: blowupthemoon
Sent: Tue 7/27/10 5:55 PM
To: jc@grenadegloves.com

You do realize that it is illegal to text and drive at the same time, right?

Here's an excerpt from the law the NY took effect 11/1/2009:
" Drivers are prohibited from using portable electronic devices such as cell phones, blackberries, laptops, or other types of electronic two-way messaging systems to send text messages or emails while driving."

Doesn't say anything about exceptions while in traffic. I hope you don't get caught.

I asked you a straight forward question - did you write the email - to which you have failed to provide a response. As a result, I see no reason to answer your question about my relationship with Chris. Yet another example Joe of you needing to play by the same rules as everyone else.

Good luck and god bless.

Poor Mr. Joseph...we really shouldn't villianize a man who can barely string sentences together with the proficiency of a 3rd grader.

**theetruscan** · 07-27-2010, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by blowupthemoon

RE: thank you‏
From: JC (jc@grenadegloves.com)
Sent: Tue 7/27/10 5:16 PM
To: blowupthemoon

No thats not what i said, what i said is that is what he posted but he has been spoken to politely and legally over 7 months ago only you and the other complainers did not get those emails
Even the ones fron dustin they are not for public viewing he made the issue not us we 12 photograhers we use everyday of the week
We also have no problem paying but he wanted to push and threaten

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

Poor Mr. Joseph...we really shouldn't villianize a man who can barely string sentences together with the proficiency of a 3rd grader.

I'd always been under the impression that sentences contain punctuation.

**anjinsan** · 07-27-2010, 05:52 PM

Hey Chris,
As a fellow photog I thought I might try to help a little. This is what I emailed to Tim Falcone the rep for Wyoming:

Hi Tim,

I see that you are the Sales Rep for Wyoming but with a New York area code. In any case, I have been reading the sad saga about Joseph L. Condorelli stiffing the photographer Chris Messervey. As a professional photographer I think this is in poor form and the response of Joseph is....well...unprofessional.

Check it out: http://messerveyphoto.wordpress.com/...orate-america/

I am also the father of two young skiers, uncle to numerous skier nephews and friends with many more kids and parents. Until this matter is resolved with Chris I am afraid I am going to have to strongly voice my opinion to all of them. Yes, we both know that my insistence that Grenade clothing will not enter my home or vehicles will not really hurt Grenade sales in Wyoming. We also both know that Joseph is completely uninterested in retaining customers. Still, it is all I can do and I will not miss an opportunity to tell every shop I enter and every person on the chairlift and in the liftline. I hope you understand I feel the need to support someone in my business because it is exactly that....my business. Turn it around, if some kid started using your logo on t-shirts would you feel it was wrong? Yes!

Thanks for your time
Rob Livingston
Gillette, Wyoming
Hottshotts Photography

This was the response......a little New York pushy I think:

I am gonna have to jump in here since this guy had the nerve to write his local rep and rob let me tell you, i dont care how much you run your mouth. Grenade sells and it makes our dealers money, no body ever gave up a bag of money because some idiot with half his wits ran his mouth. And you know what. Our customers would laugh in your face if you spoke negatively about a product they love.

In addition. Your allegations are wrong. I have known joseph for two and a half years now and have done work for him for about the same period of time. Joseph always gives credit where credit is due.
Tell your under educated photographer to watermark his photos if he is so concerned about infringement. Welcome to the real world, Photographers are a dime a dozen and with technology anyone can be an anzel adams.

The pic was removed right away after jc found out there was a concern. To me your boy isnt that good at what he does or he would have called in to ask
for joseph to post a credit. Do you know how many people will
see his name. Good marketing if you ask me. And hey, knowing JC he would have a grabbed a photo from him for the catalog and then gave him some cash. Which who knows could have developed into a good relationship with some consistant business. But hey , thats just me. Anyone can make a dollar on the street. But only the elite can make 10 everyday without lifting a finger. Hey and if your friend needs some business develoment ideas. Tell him to give me a ring and i will help him pull his head out of his ass.

Cheers man. Good luck

Tim falcone
Sent from my iPhone

Also a response from JC himself.....WOW.....I'm really ok with "not intelligent enough" for Grenade!

On Jul 26, 2010, at 11:51 PM, JC <jc@grenadegloves.com> wrote:

Do what you have to do but the reality is if you form an opinion with out thinking or hearing the whole story then neither you or who ever you speak to we do not want them buying our clothes they are not intelligent enough to be our customers
Thank you

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

I'm thinkin' if we could get these guys out west here it could be a great winter as they are cold MF's!!

anjinsan

**bklyn** · 07-27-2010, 06:01 PM

Dear Photogs:

Some clients suck.
Working on spec sucks.

Fire the former and stop doing the latter. It's not worth it.

advres · 07-27-2010, 06:09 PM

Is it a rule you have to be dumb as a fucking stump to work for Grenade?

**Mathematics** · 07-27-2010, 06:29 PM

Chris Messervey comments from another board-

thanks for all the comments. Even the ones that make me look like an asshole are valuable to me.

Some of you have been emailing Mr. Condorelli to express your feelings on the matter. Sweet. The support I’m getting on this makes me feel like I’m doing the right thing. I guess he’s been writing back telling people that I’ve been paid and that all I wanted was to have the photo removed etc. To date, I have not been paid and I never asked them to take the photo down. All I wanted to be paid for my work. I’ve been following the posts on newschoolers.com and TGR and taking into account everything thats been said.

For the record, the emails I posted have not been edited whatsoever. I will admit that I omitted 2 emails I sent Jordan in the early days of this battle because he didn’t reply and they just added length to an already lengthy blog post. Anyone Interested in the entire gmail thread is free to ask me for it.

I wasn’t asking for a huge amount of money. The photo cost me more to take than I was asking when you factor in gas to Revelstoke, sled gas, Tim Hortons, beer etc.

I didn’t really expect this to blow up like it did. Now that it has, I’m not quitting.

**DoWork** · 07-27-2010, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by advres

Is it a rule you have to be dumb as a fucking stump to work for Grenade?

No, but I bet when Joe Douchebag CEO is interviewing, he fancies himself an ACE businessman, so when other douchebag guido fucktards come in looking for jobs, he thinks to himself "Wow, this guy is great! I could really get along with a fucking meathead retard like this guy- he seems like an ACE!"

Why do I get the feeling that stupid rolls uphill in this company?

linky to Joey Capslock's pic in 3...2...1...

http://www.yobeat.com/wp-content/upl...9/11/joec4.jpg

advres · 07-27-2010, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by Finstah

Indeed, the guys who work at Grenade don't sound too intelligent.

But they are right about one thing; your beef is with that Dustin dude. He's the one who gave your photo away, after you gave it to him...

WRONG... If I give you a knife and you use it in a way that is against the law like fucking stabbing someone to death it isn't my fault it is yours. They PUBLISHED a photo on their website without finding out who it was from, who needed credit, who needed to get paid, etc. It is 100% their fault. It could have been handled better from the get go from the photog by watermarking it but it is not his fault they published it without his consent or payment.

**neck beard** · 07-27-2010, 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by anjinsan

As a fellow photog I thought I might try to help a little. This is what I emailed to Tim Falcone the rep for Wyoming

This was the response......a little New York pushy I think:

...rob let me tell you, i dont care how much you run your mouth. Grenade sells and it makes our dealers money, no body ever gave up a bag of money because some idiot with half his wits ran his mouth.

...Welcome to the real world, Photographers are a dime a dozen and with technology anyone can be an anzel adams.

...But hey , thats just me. Anyone can make a dollar on the street. But only the elite can make 10 everyday without lifting a finger. Hey and if your friend needs some business develoment ideas. Tell him to give me a ring and i will help him pull his head out of his ass.

Tim falcone
Sent from my iPhone

Dear Tim: Verily, you are a soulless cunt. I no longer think there is a place in the mountains for everyone.

"A bag of money"

loJack · 07-27-2010, 08:22 PM

You know what else is "a dime a dozen" shitty fucking overpriced gloves. This probably won't be the end of GAYNADE, unfortunately,but man their employees sure are acting like douche bags.

doughboyshredder · 07-27-2010, 08:25 PM

I got an e-mail from some dude in India asking if he could use my gulmarg pictures he found on flickr for an Indian travel site. Of course I said yes.

Point is even on the other side of the planet, they understand using someones work without their permission.

I am even more blown away by the bullshit responses from those choad guzzlers.

**tripice351** · 07-27-2010, 08:28 PM

Originally Posted by Greasy, coked out douchebag guido from Jersey who looks like Joe Pesci's retarded big brother - aka Grenade CEO Joe C

Do what you have to do but the reality is if you form an opinion with out thinking or hearing the whole story then neither you or who ever you speak to we do not want them buying our clothes they are not intelligent enough to be our customers
Thank you

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

I wrote a Haiku.

irony makes this
the best e-mail in the thread
dingo now looks smart

**misfit toy** · 07-27-2010, 08:40 PM

Could we at least get a photo of some pro pigtail or ponytail gals. Please include the hannahs. ITS A GREAT TIME FOR MORE USA GOODS .

saaka! · 07-27-2010, 09:18 PM

I hate to be that guy, but fuc its Grenade. They made there name with gorilla marketing and did it well... from what I have read they a made a decision to go with a corporate mind set and hired the guy in question.

You can boycott all you want(and I support it) but most of this world and there targeted customer (the everyday joey) doesn't have the brain space to understand fair pay in photography or really care. Sadly this will just direct attention to the brand and remind darrel and his other brother darrel that they need a grenade dicut on there truck.

They took a stab at MMA clothes... I would guess they got money on the brain and obviously don't give a shit.

But I could be wrong...

**flyandski365** · 07-28-2010, 09:38 AM

Who the hell is Anzel Adams?

**MMP** · 07-28-2010, 09:59 AM

Originally Posted by anjinsan

Do what you have to do but the reality is if you form an opinion with out thinking or hearing the whole story then neither you or who ever you speak to we do not want them buying our clothes they are not intelligent enough to be our customers
Thank you

Sent from my HTC Touch Pro2 on the Now Network from Sprint®.

Do i sense a joint venture between 333 and Grenade? It makes sense, both being super selective about the smarts and attitudes of their customer...

Originally Posted by tripice351

I wrote a Haiku.

irony makes this
the best e-mail in the thread
dingo now looks smart

hilarious.

**bmg97** · 07-28-2010, 10:02 AM

Originally Posted by flyandski365

Who the hell is Anzel Adams?

Joey Buttafuoco !

**Captain Anal** · 07-28-2010, 10:03 AM

time to peel that giant sticker off the back of my truck

**Danno** · 07-28-2010, 10:11 AM

right now, this is just pissing into the wind. Grenade needs to see some direct effect for this thread and incident to have any meaning.

**Dexter Rutecki** · 07-28-2010, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by flyandski365

Who the hell is Anzel Adams?

Relative of American brewer and patriot, Zam Adams.

**freshie247** · 07-28-2010, 05:02 PM

Anyone can be Ansel Adams? F*ck why wasn't I told sooner! I could be raking in the big bucks & hiring hitters to take care of any disgruntled employees.